Bruno Maçães, senior adviser at Flint Global and writer, and Pol Morillas, director of the Barcelona Centre for International Affairs (CIDOB), speak with Agenda Pública journalist Jorge de Diego Hurtado about the transformation of the international landscape. Both take it for granted that change is under way and that the system of Western hegemony will not return, but argue that the shape of this new system, its principles and its advantages are still taking form.